Just 2 Minutes - Interviews by Kamil Sarji

14-Unveiling the Reality of Death in a Home with Jonathan Agudelo

• Kamil Sarji • Episode 14

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In this powerful and unsettling episode of Just 2 Minutes, Kamil Sarji welcomes Jonathan Agudelo from Comparion Insurance, who shares his harrowing experiences working at a coroner's office and performing crime scene cleanup. This episode dives deep into the often overlooked and uncomfortable realities of death, especially when it occurs in a home. Jonathan brings to light the shocking details of what happens to a body after death, from the decomposition process to the physical and emotional toll it takes on those tasked with handling the deceased.

Listeners will gain insight into the hidden damages that bodily fluids can cause to a property, often requiring extensive cleanup and repairs that most people never consider. Jonathan also discusses the critical role that insurance plays in these situations, helping to mitigate the financial burden on homeowners and families during such tragic events.

Kamil and Jonathan discuss how these experiences have shaped their understanding of life, death, and the importance of proper insurance coverage. They explore real-life scenarios where death has left a significant impact on homes and the legal and logistical challenges that follow. From stories of unexpected death to the grim reality of crime scenes, this episode offers a rare glimpse into a world that few ever see, but many should be aware of.

This episode is marked for mature audiences due to its graphic content, making it essential listening for those in real estate, insurance, or anyone curious about the unspoken aspects of death in a home. Prepare yourself for a conversation that is as enlightening as it is sobering.

Whether you're a seasoned agent looking to stay ahead, a newcomer eager to learn, or a client seeking reliable real estate advice, "Just 2 Minutes" offers a wealth of information in a convenient and enjoyable format. Join us as we explore tips, tricks, and insights from industry leaders and professionals that can help you navigate the dynamic world of real estate.

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he's in the car seat, he's in this car and he's like this, And I, by the shirt, just kind of positioned him a little. And when I moved, um, you know, you have air trapped in your lungs and the whole nine. And this guy's been, as he was passing away, he was breathing in the smoke. And so, when I moved him, A little puff of smoke came out. Wow. Welcome, everybody. I'm kamil Sarji with Gold Door Realty. I'm your host today with just two minutes. And today I have Jonathan Agudelo. Agudelo, yeah. Agudelo is with Comparion Insurance Agency. Yeah. A Liberty Mutual company. Correct. Yes. Well, but first, before we start, so the way this works is for the first two minutes, I'm going to ask random questions. Yeah. Okay, so we have like two minutes to fart around and then we'll go into insurance. And I want to hear more about your history before insurance. Yeah, the, uh, the body stuff. The good stuff. Yeah. Yeah, okay, okay. So, if you have a weak stomach and you're watching this or listening to this, you can fast forward or just listen to the two minutes and, but really interesting stuff and I'm looking forward to going over that. So, I have my timer over here, so we can do the two minutes. And just remember, like, you can take your time answering it, but we do have two minutes. All right, sounds good. Not too fast, not too slow. All right. Okay, just like a motorcycle. Yeah, yeah. Is that right? Is that what they say? I don't know, but it makes sense. You go too slow, you fall over, you go too fast, you know, what happens there? My grandma used to say, like, don't drink soda too fast and not too slow. Yeah. Because then you'll be like burping, sometimes farting. Makes sense. Yeah, depending on the soda. Alright, here we go. Alright, so, uh, have you ever played the game Chubby Bunny? Chubby Bunny. I have not. What is it? Uh, you should, you should try. It's pretty cool. Um, it's basically you take a marshmallow and put it in your mouth. You can't chew it, and you have to say, Chubby Bunny. Oh, yes, yes, yes. I have seen that. Yeah, I've seen that. I've never played it. Okay. Never played it. Be careful. Um, so if you're walking down the street, right, and, uh, and someone came out, came out, or was sitting on the ground, they were like, hey, could you pass this, uh, paper to a couple of, uh, a couple of doors down at the shop, a few down, doors down? Would you do that? Ooh, I think I would have to ask if I could see what the paper says. Hmm. Because You know, that could be somebody that just has a working arrangement with them, you know, saying, Hey, you know, they'll help him out with, you said somebody on the street, right? That's just on the ground or whatever. They could be somebody that offers them food or offers them help and what have you. Or it could be this person is mentally unstable and just wrote some very threatening stuff and handed me a paper saying, Hey, hand this to these people. I can't, I can't do that. So, I'd have to have permission to read it. In order to decide whether not to do it. You think it's possible for apes to take over the world? Um, it's, uh If so, and to add to that question, if so, what weapon would they use? Oof, okay. So, I, would it be possible? Yes, I think. with the right, you know, uh, learning or the cognitive, you know, some kind of, uh, Breakthrough and some of this stuff that they do with testing and what? Let's assume it did Yeah, so it it worked and what have you right? Uh, so yes, definitely definitely capable and uh Weaponry, I feel like they do a good combination of primitive because they're just so much stronger than us And, you know, some of the stuff we use. Cool. What'd you think? I like it. Interesting. When you say random questions, I mean, you mean it. It's very random. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yeah. All right, John. So, I met you at my Cigar Business Network. Yes, yes. And thank you again for having me there. Absolutely. I know my presence there was very random, but the way I found out He was just like, you know, hey, do you want to come to this event? I actually, backtrack, I was like, hey, you know, we haven't connected, we haven't touched base since I moved back up here. Let's go do lunch. And he was like, you know, no, no, no. Let's go to this event I'm going to. I got invited to this event. Let's go to this event. And I'm like, all right, is it an open event? He's like, yeah, yeah, you know, you can come on. I was like, okay, fine. When I walked in, I saw a set of them. Oh, this was not open at all. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. I'm like a special group of people. I just walked out of an event, just assuming I should be there. But, uh, thank you. Did we look confused when you walked in? Absolutely. You guys looked as confused as I did. I'm sure I looked like a lost child in there. Is that a human? Yeah, like what's going on? But I do appreciate you guys. You know, letting me stay, and I enjoyed it very much. And actually, after it was done, I stayed there with Alejandro and I forgot his name, so I don't know if you're gonna want to leave that in there. It was the three guys. It's Bill Oh, Bob and Sal? Sal. Yeah. Okay. So, I could Can I repeat that? Oh, that's fine. I don't edit anything. Oh, okay. Good to know. It's as if it's live, you know, as if we're doing this. All right. So, Sal. Sorry, Sal for forgetting your name for a second. But, yeah. So, Alejandro and Sal and I stayed and talked for almost until 10 o'clock after. It was great. We talk about a little bit of everything, business and then just stuff in general. Awesome. Yeah. We talked about some interesting things. Yes. You and I. Yeah. And, so let's talk about what you do. You, you sell insurance? Yes. Yep. So, I, uh Liberty Mutual Company. Yeah. It's Comparion Insurance. It is a Liberty Mutual company. What we do is we try to pair our client with the best possible carrier and coverage for them. Obviously, being the real estate game, you know, when somebody gets a homeowner's insurance, nine times out of ten, the client is just like, Hey, they said I need an insurance and I need to pay this much a month. And that's it. That's all they worry about. What we like to do, especially me coming from the mortgage industry a few years back, I like to make sure, okay, yes, obviously we have to try to see if it fits where you qualify for, but you got to make sure you're covered, and you got to make sure you're protected how you need to be. So, a very big part of what I do when I was doing mortgages, and now that I'm back in insurance again, is education. I educate my clients. I tell them this is the coverage you need because XYZ. How do you feel about that? Does that make sense? Because yes, ideally you should have this coverage, but if it doesn't fit in their wheelhouse, if they can't afford it, then it's, you know, we'll kind of work back and see where we can make it so it makes sense for them and they're still protected. So, a very big part of what I do is making sure they understand what they're doing. Not just, I need this for my house, or I need this because state requires me to have this for a car. So, as far as before you got into this, and again, I think it ties into insurance a lot, is, like, specifics of, as far as, like, insurance, If you have insurance and, like, someone dies in the house. Yes. What's that look like as far as insurance side? So, on the insurance side, on your homeowner's insurance policy, on your, you know, if you have a rental property and what have you, there's different parts of it, right? So, there's gonna be what takes care of the damage that is done to your house. So, as I told you, I used to pick up bodies for the coroner's office and I used to do crime scene cleanup. So, people don't realize how damaging bodily fluids are. Yeah. On wood, on plastic, on metal, like, it eats through so much. And without getting too gory, there's been a lot of scenes where I've seen you, like, one of the main things we do, we just cut it out. We, there's not even any scrubbing or cleaning of it. It's, you just cut it out because you know, there's no saving that. It's gonna keep coming up. So, on the insurance side, there's the aspect of the property, you know, the damage to the structure, damage to anything that might be in there, the floors. Carpets, what have you, having to be replaced. A lot of times, with renters, the apartment complex requires you to have renter's insurance. But, again, the complex's insurance themselves is what's going to cover the damage to those floorboards and to that stuff because Not the renter's insurance. Correct, because the renter's insurance is going to cover your contents. Yeah. So, sometimes You're not the contents. Yeah, correct, correct. Your stuff. Yeah, yeah. The stuff you're wearing is your contents. Clothes, furniture and all that, but sometimes people get the wrong idea and think like that's something that their insurance has to take care of when it comes to that stuff. If they have an apartment, if they're living in an apartment, no, that's the buildings. So, if the tenant dies and all the, everything in their unit gets burned or whatever, destroyed, who gets that money if they're dead? So, that's actually a very good question. So, from the way it works is, just like anything else, you're gonna have some kind of will, testament, what have you. The thing is, the purpose of insurance is to make you whole again. So Ha ha ha ha ha ha But if you're dead But if you're dead, you know, so That's actually a very interesting question because that's something that I operate under the assumption whoever you left stuff to, if there's somebody else that lived there with you and what have you, is gonna be the person that gets it. A portion of it or if not, whatever it's covered, but that's one that I'm gonna ask myself and investigate and find out because that's a good one. Because yeah, I operate on the assumption it's that, but again, the purpose of insurance is never to benefit, it's to make you whole again, okay? In regards to property, homeowner's insurance or automobile, it's always to make you whole. You're not supposed to profit from it or nobody's supposed to profit from the insurance that makes you whole again. So, if you lost your life, I mean, in that kind of situation, yeah, I don't know. I'll find out and I'll definitely let you know. Yeah. So, all these homes that, I mean, if someone dies in the home, if they were sliced open or shot, then blood would be everywhere. But if they died in suffocation or any other, not to be gory, like, goodness, this is like, really touchy subject. This answer is gonna be a little gory. Yeah, go ahead. No, be as gory. I'm gonna mark this as, like, mature audience. Okay, so, it doesn't matter how you pass away. Obviously, some are messier than others, right? You get shot or cut. You know, for example, I had a clean up I had to do where the lady, unfortunately, decided to end her own life, and not in a way that was pills or something simple. She cut her throat. So, there was, there was everywhere. But it could have been worse because if that had happened and then nobody found her body for a few days, a week, or what have you. So what ends up happening is your body, all the gases, everything inside you starts kind of accumulating. And so like if, kind of you've seen roadkill. Sometimes they're flat, whatever, but sometimes you'll see like what looks like a big flat body. Fat raccoon, like, bloated, and it's dead, especially in the summer. It's because all the gases are accumulating. Eventually, you pop, that's what we call it. You pop, and what it is, it doesn't necessarily have to be like a boom. It can be, but basically what happens is those fluids come out. It's going to split your skin at some point, and all those fluids are going to come out. So, if you didn't die from getting cut open, eventually you're going to blow up, and there's going to be stuff. And those are the messiest ones. To be honest, those are the ones that do the most damage. Because it's not just blood. It's blood, it's stomach fluids. All the, everything inside, right? All those fluids in the intestine, and in your stomach, and you know, your liver, and what have you. All of that is just spilled out. Wow, that's crazy. I never knew about that. That's pretty intense. Yeah. So, going into those homes, and if someone, I mean, in a bed, everything would soak up into the bed. No, not just soak up. It would soak up into the bed. So, that's one that happens often. Um, you know, somebody passed away in their sleep. Somebody that doesn't have much family, doesn't see much people, they're a little bit of a loner, they passed away in their sleep, and nobody knows about it until that smell starts coming. You know, you're walking by the property and you're like, oh, what is that? Do a welfare check and they find them, right? Perfect example of that, I had one where this young man passed away in his sleep. And by the time we had to come in, the mattress was completely, it's, you know, it's that dark, like anybody that's seen blood, you get that maroon, reddish, but then it turns like maroon brownish once it's like settled into something like cloth or what have you. And it's been there for a while. The whole mattress was like that. Then underneath It was, it had leaked through, and it had that whole spot of wood underneath it was just covered in water as well. Yeah, and then that one was one that even though we didn't see it happening, we knew it was an actual physical pop. Because from the bed, then there was a splatter like this, and it's where the person split. Yeah, so where they, you know, so that one was an actual physical pop. It doesn't always happen that way, but that one was like that. But what you were saying about the mattresses and stuff, yeah, whatever they're on, Bodily fluids, I don't know if you guys know this, but it's, they're, they're very strong, very powerful, very potent. And they soak through, and they will come through, and they'll drip through, and if nobody had discovered it, that would've eaten through the wood, and it would be going, getting into the floorboards, getting underneath. Like dog urine on wood. Yes, correct. It's hard to get it off. Correct. Same thing. Yeah, yep. You know, I bet it's like, it smells way worse than that. That's why, oh yeah, the smell is, When you go into these rooms, like when you go into these homes, are you wearing like a mask to not smell things? Like, and is it, can you catch anything from, Yeah, of course, absolutely. Any kind of bodily fluids, there's the risk of blood borne, you know, pathogens and stuff. So, you have to be very careful. So, depending on what I was doing, right? Whether it was the crime scene clean up or if I was picking up a body, you don't know what people have. So, somebody can come in here and got us both, boom, boom, we're here. I don't know what you have, diseases, not, what have you. Not saying that he does. And I'm clean, I checked, uh, last Tuesday. Yeah, and vice versa, right? Okay where good, it's all about clean, yeah yeah, no worries. But, you know, so there's training you have to do to deal with blood, just like anybody that deals with blood or bodily fluids. But I will tell you, can you catch up from breathing it? I mean, most airborne type viruses don't last in the air that long. So, it depends on how it goes. By the time I'm there to pick up a body, for example, it's been hours. You know, the police have come, ambulances come and try to resuscitate if they can, or what have you, or whatever. So, it's usually been hours from the time the police have come to when I come. And what they do, they'll take their pictures and do their stuff without moving the body, like exactly how it lays. And then I would come and now we would roll them over, they take pictures of the back, and what have you, everything else, and then we put them in the bag. Very rudimentary way to explain it there, but, uh, yeah, it's basically it. But, to answer your question in regards to equipment that gets worn in the whole night, in the experience I had, okay? Uh, I'm not gonna mention what states I was in or anything, just in case. Somebody had that, you know, I might have given an example of somebody that was in that state, but where I was, you had the option of putting on full body stuff or the mask or what have you, but in all reality, what you need is steel toe boots because of the stretcher. If that stretcher sometimes did, they have a little defect or something will happen and it'll catch and it'll drop on your foot. So you need steel toe boots and gloves. Okay, I can imagine you wearing the steel toe boots with shorts, tank top, and gloves. No, no. Did you wear them? No, no, just boxers. No, so it, it was, uh. Then he can get rid of the stuff. It's like pants that you would wear, like thick pants that you would do any kind of, like, heavy kind of job. Construction. Construction kind of work or whatever with. And just whatever company you're working for, the polo, and that's it. You're very careful, you're trained to not step even on a drop of blood when what have you. But at the end of the day, sometimes you have, I don't know how detailed I can get into this. Go ahead. Okay, so I had one person that I had to pick up. The man was on a, on a bed. He had ended his life with a gun to the head, and I was having trouble. Me and my co worker were having trouble trying to grab him, because that's a very bloody scene, so blood is very slippery. And as we were trying to position him, my finger slipped into the bullet hole. Wow. So, where it went, pew! And I was like, I looked at my partner and I was like, I have a little bit of a grip. I want to just shuffle quick so we can actually, because I couldn't grab, I was struggling. So we did, it was just, it was just a boom, right onto the bag that was laid out on the bed. But that's there, I couldn't help but get, you know, I was there already, I had the blood. You know, it's a different story, so I got blood on my gloves and what have you. But for the most part, you kind of just, it depends on what you can tolerate, smell wise. I never wore a mask. Now, does it mean I can just smell anything and be fine with it? No, there was some that stuck with me and I wouldn't be able to eat a certain food for a while because it reminded me of that odor or what have you. But yeah, for the most part it comes down to what you can tolerate. The mandatory is you gotta have your gloves and you gotta have your steel toed boots and pants. Like not any, and not anybody can do what you did. Like, people, like, if I was there, I'd be, like, puking nightmares for months. Yeah. Like, this sticks in my mind forever, like, but there's people who are special who can actually deal with that. Well, the way I put it, always joking around with friends and whatever, is I'm just like, you gotta be a certain level of messed up to be able to do that and not take it home with you. Yeah. I just, I happen to be there, right? But in all reality, it comes down to how you dealt or heard or learned about death in your past, growing up. Have you had close people pass away? Have you had family members pass away? Friends pass away as you've grown? Have you seen any kind of crazy stuff? You know, I'm originally from Colombia. I was born here, my parents are originally from Colombia. But we took trips to Colombia, and I remember when I was nine years old, I saw somebody, well not saw him get shot, but we were walking, we heard boom, boom, boom. And then there was a crowd of people, like, Carrying this guy, trying to get him to an ambulance, to wherever this guy had got shot, and I remember seeing that. So, stuff like that, where you kind of get a little desensitized, and on top of that, it depends on how you feel about, there's religious beliefs, there's all kinds of stuff, and the way I saw it was, I'm not picking up that person anymore. I'm picking up the vessel, you know what I mean? Yeah. And so, does that mean I'm gonna just toss him into the bag? No. But, still very respectful, did what I had to do, and nine times out of ten, there was family in the house while we're doing it. So, you gotta make sure to be very respectful and all that, but, yeah, I saw it as, you know, that's the vessel. So, a little easier to assimilate it, to be like, okay, you know, hey, this is, somebody has to do this. This person's not here anymore. They're not suffering, they're not feeling any of this, and we just gotta do what you gotta do. Gosh, I'm like, my body's like, whoa, and I haven't even looked at any pictures or anything. It's just you describing things. I mean, to me, like, when there's a dead mouse in the house, you know, I know that smell, like, walk in, like, oh, it's that smell. It's a dead mouse. So, obviously, it's not, it doesn't smell like that. No, it's a lot more, and again, this is very detailed and graphic at this point, but it's a lot more like a meat market, and just imagine the meat's been there too long, when it comes to somebody that's been there, right? The crazy part is, just about every single one, what you smell first is feces, when it's not a decomposed body. Oh, wow. Yeah, well, because you release your bowels. Pee and poop. Uh, no, but usually poop, but yeah, if you had anything like, you know, if you were holding it, let's say, and that happened, then yeah. But yeah, you release your bowels, so that's one of the first things you smell when you walk in. Oof, I don't want that to happen to me. Like, I want to prevent, like, you know, if I die, I don't want urine or poop. So you just, yeah. Just keep going to the bathroom. Walk around with an enema, man. Just clear it out. Clear it out. All day. And don't eat. I don't know. I don't know what to tell you, man. Cause, I mean, it's ten times out of ten. It's not even nine out of ten, man. Every single body I've picked up has been like that. Fires? You've been into homes with fire? not a home, but a vehicle. So, there was a person that, the vehicle crashed, burst into flames. And, yeah, so we went to go pick up this. But this is the one that actually affected me being able to enjoy a certain food for a whole summer. So, again, I'm just gonna go. You stop me if I, if I'm getting too detailed, okay? So, what it is is Was it a steak? No, no. So, what happens is, we don't realize You know, we always say it, people talk about, yeah, we're just meat and bones, ha ha ha, whatever, whatever. But, you don't realize it until you actually look like meat. So, this person had crashed, and it was a very strong crash, and so they were cut all the way up here, right? And like, these fingers bones were exposed, and up to here, it was just like, Hanging, but the meat was burnt and it looked like burnt barbecue chicken. Wow. Burnt, not barbecue chicken, but burnt chicken from like chicken grill grilled chicken. Yes. Oh my gosh. Like that you were doing like a charcoal grill or something. It was like white meat and it was very, that was, I remember that was one of the first things that stuck out to me about that one. And what happens is the smell is very similar to not a good, not a well cooked chicken, right. But a burnt chicken that you would have at a cookout. That's very much what it smelled like. So that whole summer, if I went to a cookout, and there were, there were, there were barbecuing chicken, or they were making chicken on the grill. Oh, man. I mean, it wouldn't make me nauseous or anything, I just wouldn't eat. You wouldn't eat? I wouldn't eat. That? No, I wouldn't eat. At all? I wouldn't be able to eat. I would have to eat at home after or something. Yeah, because it was just Oh, damn, man. It would, because that one, with there being a fire, like, that just, it's stronger. It brings that, and it sticks in your nostril hairs, and, like, I showered, I did everything, and I could still smell it for, like, days, like, just trapped in my nose. So for the whole summer, you couldn't eat grilled chicken? No. No. But now no problem. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And again, it had to be in like a cookout slash barbeque kind of setting, because that has its own like smell, because of that, you know, because it's an open flame, you know, burning it versus like just on a pan, right? Just having it on a pan or something, that's different. But like that kind of setting, I just couldn't do it. Yeah, and that one was very interesting because I also got my first scare in that, in which I went to, you know, he's in the car seat, he's in this car and he's like this, And I, by the shirt, just kind of positioned him a little. And when I moved, um, you know, you have air trapped in your lungs and the whole nine. And this guy's been, as he was passing away, he was breathing in the smoke. And so, when I moved him, A little puff of smoke came out. Wow. Yeah, and I remember stepping back and being like, Oh my God, is this guy still, and then I had to like, Oh wait, no, obviously not. Yeah, it's because the smoke, whatever. But you do get that. Once in a while, you'll get that little something that makes you wait. Whoa, hold on, you know? But then after a second, you kind of remember, Oh yeah, that's right, this is normal for the situation. Oof, gosh. Wow, I just have to like, get myself back, process, together here. Yeah, so, I know we're all like, meat and bones, a vessel, but the soul aspect, you know, it's hard to Separate it? Separate, like, when there's a body, I know there's a soul, always, but when there isn't, it's weird. Yeah, yeah, as much as I'm talking about this so freely and whatever, it's not that nothing ever made me like, Sad to see or like, cause it did, at the end of the day, it's somebody is no longer here and their family members are now suffering without them and if they have kids, they're not going to watch their kids grow up and if they had, you know, what have you. So there's very many things that like, especially body positioning wise, that can kind of show you what their last moments were like and some of those were pretty hard. Like, there was a guy that his truck rolled over on him. He got into an accident and he was ejected and the truck rolled over on him. When I got there, all I could see was the truck was on its side and I could see the top of his head. So, when we got there, you know, the fire department and everybody there were starting to like, get the truck off. Lift it off? Yeah, so once it lifted off, You saw his hands like this. Oh no. So you know he was ejected. He was alive for a second. He saw it coming or, you know, did what he could to try to So that kind of stuff, it sticks with you, you know, like, Ah, man, like, that sucks. This per you can tell this person was It wasn't like, oh, I don't even know what happened and I'm gone. It's no they you know saw and and tried to fight so stuff like that kind of sticks I bet a fire in the home to like, you know, yeah, I didn't get to experience those I didn't get to experience Not none of the bodies I picked up was fires in the home stuff like that did affect me and then always whenever it was A child that's always yeah, that's a completely different There's no separating the vessel from the soul or anything there that wouldn't if you ever you know And I hope nobody watching or you have to experience Losing a loved one in your home or anything like that. But if there's ever a case like that, the way you'll see the fire department, the police, and the person that comes to pick up the body, very much normal conversation. You know, they're not going to be like, joking and laughing in your face, but normal conversation, carrying on and what have you. When there's a child, there's, it's just dead silence. No unnecessary words are spoken. So, if I'll arrive and I would be like, Alright, so where, you know, what room is Ian? That room over there. And that's it. Like, there's no nothing. Because it's, it's just such a different feeling for everyone. As you can imagine, when it's a child, you know. And I'm sure some cops, like, you know, have some memories of things that they just can never forget. Oh yeah. Yeah, and I always say, So, my job was very much, I know what I'm going into. My job is, to go pick up bodies. But I will never ever compare it to police, EMTs, firemen, who are actually trying to save lives. That's got to be a million times harder and a million times harder to, I can't imagine you can just be like, Oh, I'm just going to separate the person from what have you because you saw them while they were still that person and you tried to help them. You know what I mean? So it's got to be 10 times harder. My part, it's almost transactional. Like, you know, you can't save this person. This person's been gone. They're dead and you're going to come and just remove them from wherever they are. So I do want to say that because I feel like people forget about that aspect of police officers, firemen, emergent, you know, EMTs. Like, people that work in the ER, that's a very much, very, way different, and it's gotta be so much harder psychologically to deal with that stuff. So I commend them a lot, because, yeah, it's crazy stuff, you see. Do you sell life insurance? I do, and it's actually one of the things Do you want their, like, some, some of these people you, oh, I didn't have to wonder, sometimes I would hear it. You would overhear them talking and like in between family members, you know, let's say it's somebody's mother passes away and then, you know, their cousins and aunts are over and what have you, and as I'm removing the body, they're like, did she have a life insurance? Oh no, I don't know what we're gonna do, auntie this and that, or, yeah, I think she did, but it was with work, so I don't know how, how it worked. So it was very much, it was very eye opening. That happened a lot more often than not, especially when it was somebody being picked up in a home that you would hear, like, people asking those questions. And I would hope That's a weird thing to talk about, but Well, it's because they gotta think. They gotta think right away, because Logically, yeah. The, you know, the body is taken somewhere. It gets taken to the morgue. From the morgue, it has to go to the funeral home or wherever you're gonna go. And right there, you start incurring fees, you know? So, if you don't have a life policy in effect, you're, you know, in something to deal with that aspect of it, then you gotta start with the GoFundMes and this and that and, um What limitations do life insurance have, skydiving as one? Well, so yeah, it depends on what you do. I mean, there's different, like the guy shot himself Correct. So, many life policies, and you know, I can't speak to every single one, but many life policies have a period in which they will, like, you cannot die of suicide. of a self inflicted wound. If you do, you're not covered. Because obviously you got it for that reason. Correct, yeah. Or like, or maybe even if you didn't, they still give like, oh, maybe he did but he's just building up the courage to do it and he finally did it, right? And it took him two years, right? So there's a, there's a period where it can't be. So there's a legal period and then there's what the different companies decide they want to do and will accept in regards. So the legal is the maximum. Is the minimum. Is the minimum, okay, sorry. Correct, yeah, the minimum. And then some companies may be like, Well, legally, it's, let's say, Depends, because it varies by state, right? So let's just say it's two years. And then some company will be like, Well, we won't cover it for five years. So it all depends. There's layers to it. Just like with mortgages and stuff, right? That, you know, you have that guidelines. But then each company has their own guidelines. Like, all right, this is what we legally have to do. But, on top of that, we're going to be extra careful, right? So, there's stuff like that. Certain careers, it's not that they can't get a life policy, but there's specific policies that are obviously going to be more pricey that will work for them. Right, higher risk. So higher risk, because it's all insurance is based on is risk, risk, risk, risk, right? What are the chances that when it comes to life insurance that you're gonna pass away? That's why for a six week old child, you can get a policy at twelve, fifteen dollars. That would cost a 40 year old man 350 dollars because Closer to the end. Closer To expiration. Yeah, yeah. Don't like to think about it that way because I'm a 40 year old man. But yes, it's what it is. So, yeah, depending on the risk level of their career or their activities that they do. Like if you're skydiving, you know, that's not your career. You just like to go once a year or something. And, you know, they ask those questions. So, when those get disclosed Then it's gonna determine which way you can go, which kind of policy you need to take out, and how much it's gonna cost. Have you ever walked in on, like, a murder or suicide? Uh, yes. I had to do a murder suicide where it was the wife and the husband, and it was with a shotgun, so it was quite messy. But, yeah, I had to walk in on one of those. Those are, believe it or not, sometimes easier. Because, usually, one of those, like, well, the ones I had. It's, you know, it all, it can happen anywhere, right? Technically, you can do this right now, right? But, when it's a setting like where I was, it was a more rural area, and it was an older couple. And, she shot him, and then shot herself. And then that's it. And then it was, you know, the bangs were heard by neighbors that were a distance away. But there wasn't, it's more isolated, kind of, like, they didn't have, like, a bunch of family there and what have you. Okay, like kids. Yeah, it was a little, yeah, so it's usually, and especially since that's usually something that's messy, even if there was family, they're not going to be in the house and not going to be allowed to be, you know what I mean? So it makes it a little easier. Why does that make it a little easier? Because there's a reason they call it deadweight, right? Deadweight is heavy. You're not helping yourself get carried, right? I, for example, weigh about 200 pounds. 190 to 200 is where I fluctuate, right? If you wanted to put your arms under my shoulders, you know, under my arms and pick me up, you would be able to do it and I would help, even subcon without knowing. Like, just by elevating a little bit as you pick up or what have you and Wow, okay. But, if I'm laying here on the ground Passed out. Passed out or dead, it's 10 times harder to just try to lift, even to just roll somebody over sometimes. So, when it, why does that matter? Because we're human, and I'm picking up a heavy person, and it's like carrying a heavy object, so. It's not always going to be pretty. It's not going to look pretty. So, not having the family have to see that is, makes it a little easier. You get what I mean? Yeah. Yeah, because even if they're in the bag, it's still, you know, if you're struggling and what have you to move it, it's, you know, because sometimes you can only get the stretcher so far. Those bags, man, they can hold a lot of weight. Yeah. Well, there's special ones. There's special ones for the bigger ones. So, like, I had one person that was 450 pounds. And the bag that I had was This is when I was newer to this was at its limit like so I saw it was tearing it was tearing on the side So then the person that was training me was like, oh you grabbed the wrong bag here Let's grab one of these and he brought the other one out there But if I would have tried for example To bring him out and put him on the stretcher out to wearing his family's there They would have seen the tear in the bag and be able to see the exposed skin and what have you and it's like So, it's different, but yeah, there's, and depending on where you are, the first place that I used to do this for, where I did it a few years back, you had somebody working with you. It was two of us that would go to every site, and that was because the police and fire were not involved in that aspect. They wouldn't help. And it was kind of funny, actually, that like, I would look at a police officer, and he'd be like, oh man, I ain't touching that. And I'm like, you probably see worse at some point in your career, you know? So, it was interesting to me. But the other one, where I did it more recently, It was just, they would send just me because fire and police would always be willing to help. So, they were always involved. So, you didn't need more than one person. So, I, you know, I would do what I had to do. Get them in the bag, zip it, and if, you know, Hey, can you help me put them on the stretcher? Boom, we lift up the stretcher and then I just put, you know, pull them up. So Rolling them on the side sometimes could have, like, there's more fluids that come out, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Depending on, process I'm sure, Well, it depends on what happens, right? So, I had a person that jumped off a roof and landed flat on his back. So, you would imagine from seeing movies and stuff, it was It's not. He, what it was, was his head was soft, right? These bones, they're, you know, they broke once he, you know, that right here. So, it was soft back there and there was some blood coming out of his nose and his ears. Once we had to, because they always have to take pictures of like his back and what have you, once we had to roll him on his back, then it was like a puddle of blood that just came again from his ears and nose and mouth, but just gushed out. So it just stayed in there? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, it's not really like you see in the movies or in like South Park or stuff like that, that they'll show and somebody hits and it's like, yeah. No, it's not necessarily like that. It can be, right? Depending on how high you jumped, you fell for, from, or how stuff happens. But it's Our bodies are stronger than we think sometimes, at the same time more vulnerable than we'd imagine. Where a drop from somewhere where you don't think is too high can kill you, but everything can still stay inside. You know what I mean? So like, yeah, it's So, last question. Have you ever seen like a suicide where It's obviously not a suicide, like someone tried, to look like a set-up? To make it look like a, yeah, someone made it look like a, and it was, they did a terrible job or something. There was one that was very Suspicious? Very suspicious, and I would, you know, that's one thing about this job, you talk to the police as you're in the scene, like, oh, so what do you think? Like, yeah. And they all seem like something's not right, something's not right. And cause what happens is there's certain angles that bullets will take or, you know, or if depending on where you, right. Cause it was a person that shot themself in the head allegedly, allegedly. Yeah. But the way it happened, it just seemed weird. It seemed like the person would have had to like kind of do something like this because what hand was used and what, it was just weird. And so normally. If it's a self inflicted wound, you don't have to put bags over their hands or anything like, you know, you just put them in the bag and what have you. But they may, after some discussion, they were like, yeah, we're going to bag his hands to protect any evidence from scratching or defend self, you know, defending themselves. Yeah. And what I've seen more often is the opposite, where it looks like either somebody passed away by accident. And then you find out it's a suicide. So like I had one person, was a I remember it clearly, the guy was wearing all Steelers pajamas, right? Steelers stuff, and he was sick. He had been sick for a while, according to the family. And then what ended up happening was, he didn't wake up that morning. Is what it seemed like. So, I get there. The police, they don't touch them till I'm there. They don't really do anything unless they absolutely have to, right? Especially when it's somebody that's been sick and they just died peacefully in their sleep. Or so you imagine, then they wait for me to get there and then I would help. And so, as we went to go move him, it said written out in Sharpie in his hand, F it. The actual word, obviously. Okay. But it said, F it. And then there was a Sharpie on the bed. So, this person had cancer, had been suffering for quite a while, according to the family. So, he probably was just like, I'm done. I'm not gonna suffer anymore. So, now, do I know how he, what it was, what medication, or what he did? No. But, it seemed like he did it to himself. And he, you know, he meant to do it. So, I told the police officer, I'm like, hey, Check this out, look at his hand. He's like, oh, okay, never mind. We got to look at this a little different now, you know. But yeah, that one, that one I saw, that one was very clear, you know. The other one was suspicious. It was iffy, but I never, that's the one thing I hated about doing this is that I never found out the outcome if it was something like that. Wow, yeah. Unless I worked with that officer again, relatively quickly. Because then if you go three months down the road, Hey, remember this and this? Like, not really. Because they see it all the time. Do you think it'll give you more closure if you knew this story? Or, or it'll mess you up more knowing this? I feel like it'll make it less transactional. So it might have made it more difficult to continue doing what I was doing at that time. You know what I mean? Or maybe not. I don't know. But I feel like That's what made it, okay, like, this was the end of my work day. And then, next day, whatever new cases came in. Damn, John. Crazy stuff. Thank you so much for stopping by and talking to me. No, thank you. Thank you for having me, man, Thank you for stopping by. No, thank you.

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Kamil Sarji

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